Gary James' Interview With The Author Of Death of a Rolling Stone: The Brian Jones Story
Mandy Aftel



Death of a Rolling Stone: The Brian Jones Story. That's the title of a book written on Brian Jones, the blonde-haired guitarist who is credited with starting The Rolling Stones, giving them their name, and who died under very mysterious circumstances on July 3rd, 1969 when he was just 27 years old. Psychotherapist Mandy Aftel wrote a book on Brian Jones which was the culmination of some eight years of intense research, interviews, and travel. The Brian Jones Story is a fascinating account of fame, fortune and despair. We spoke to Mandy Aftel about her book.

Q - Why did you write a book on Brian Jones? Were you a fan of his?

A - I was a fan of the group. I wasn't a particular fan of his. When I was reading an interview with Keith Richards by Bob Greenfield in Rolling Stone a long time ago, I was really fascinated with what he said about Brian, how he depicted him. I was very curious about how Brian had made such a mess of things in five years, when it looked like he had so much going for him.

Q - What was the central flaw in Brian's character?

A - I don't know if I could boil it down to one, he had a lot of flaws. He was a very flawed person. But, I don't know if I look at people in that particular way. He had a lot of difficulties in that he was not successful in dealing with and resolving. If I was pressed, I'd have to say he didn't have a self. He didn't know who he was. Who he was, wasn't a good picture to him. He was looking for himself to be reflected in other opinions of himself which really bend you around the post a million times. He had an inability to delay gratification, he needed things right away. He couldn't kind of stick with something and apply some sort of discipline, which goes along with delaying gratification. He had certain problems doing what one needs to do to become mature and to survive, which are somewhat based on internal strength that some of us have more or less of. I think that Brian was in such an extreme situation that his lacks were very pronounced. He had the ability to fulfill all of his fantasies, to have many things go on in his life. Who knows how other people would hold up? They just aren't put in that position.

Q - Was there no one he could turn to for advice?

A - I'm not sure he could've taken it. He had some decent people in his life at different times. He wanted to please everyone, and if you want to please everyone, advice won't do you much good 'cause you have to choose to leave certain people behind and act on what you feel is right. Brian was so confused, he couldn't listen to good advice even if he had gotten it, although I don't think he got all that much of it.

Q - Much is made of the working relationship between Mick and Keith and Brian, and that both Mick and Keith deliberately set out to do Brian in. But, wouldn't you say that Brian Jones' worst enemy was not Mick Jagger or Keith Richards, but Brian Jones?

A - Yeah. I think they did some awful things to him, but I don't think they were his worst enemy. He was his worst enemy in some ways. He couldn't take care of himself. He couldn't survive in that world very well. I don't think they consciously went out to do him in. I think some people would like it if I thought that, but I don't.

Q - Do you feel Brian deliberately set out to destroy himself?

A - I don't think so, but he did it nevertheless. I think there's only so many times you can risk yourself against those kinds of things. There's only so much booze you can drink and pills you can take, and not end up with a heart attack or dead. There's only so many times you can drive a car fast, stoned. There's only so many times you can fool around with possibilities before something is going to happen to you. I think Brian wanted to push things to the limit. He liked a certain high, a certain excitement. I also think that Brian Jones didn't like Brian Jones all that much. Part of wanting to kill yourself is not having a lot of regard for your own body.

Q - If you were in a band with a guy like Brian Jones, a guy who showed up for both concerts and recording sessions, stoned, how would you handle it? Don't you feel that Mick and Keith did the right thing in easing him out of the group?

A - I think it starts a little bit before that. I mean, I think one has to ask why was he showing up in that state? He didn't start off that way. What happened? Here was a guy who kept the first newspaper clipping, who ran down the road to get the press, who was alert, alive, functioning, added a lot of things to the music, and all of a sudden, he was an absolute waste. How did this happen? What contributed to the fact that a man who had so much to offer, and offered a great deal, was just dead weight all of a sudden? That question would have to be addressed. To answer your question in particular, I don't know what I would do in that situation. There's a certain loyalty always to a group, and a group operation, and a group process. You can't allow one person to destroy the efforts of a group. The show must go on. I think it is difficult to know what to do. I think that Keith and Anita (Brian's girlfriend) getting together... No one encouraged Brian to write songs. They used to ridicule Brian. They used to make him feel odd man out in the band that he basically started, and did a lot of the work for. It just can't be looked at in a vacuum that Brian became a real load on the band. That happened because of things.

Q - You quote Brian as saying, "No one would choose to live the kind of life I lead. Do you really think I enjoy it?" If Brian hadn't been a musician, or a Rolling Stone, what do you think he would've done?

A - I think you have to make a separation between being a Rolling Stone and a musician. I think The Rolling Stones became something they weren't at the outset. Brian had a real struggle with that. I try to point out his contradictions, and hopefully they come across in the book. He had a certain view of the Rolling Stones, kind of in the old Blues image. You know, the old Blues singer. He basically did live that life to a great extent. I think what it had become with The Rolling Stones was not really what he wanted anymore. Brian looked like he had everything, but looking like you have everything and feeling good about what you're doing and accomplishing, are two very, very different things. The outer trappings of success may not reflect how someone actually feels about what they're doing. I think Brian was a perfect example of that. But then again, there was that conflict of, he couldn't give up those outer trappings of success because in some ways he'd been seduced by them, at least not before his death, when he decided to just get out of The Stones.

Q - At the time of Brian's death, it was reported his earnings were $2,500 a week, yet he died $300,000 in debt. Are those figures accurate?

A - I had heard a lot of different things about money, and unfortunately could never get anybody to verify it. People are often not that straight about money. I know his things were gone. Just completely ripped off. A lot of beautiful ethnic things that he wore for clothes, interesting pieces of furniture, jewelry, all sorts of things. They were just gone.

Q - Did you try to locate Anna Wohlin, the woman who was living with Brian at the time? of his death?

A - I tried a little, but those people really disappear. And, I also came along five years after Brian's death when I was doing that part of it.

Q - She would have been a key person to talk to, wouldn't she? And she just vanished from sight?

A - Oh, absolutely. The world is filled with people disappearing. Girl friends really come and go very easily. There's a very fluid quantity of them, just floating in and out.

Q - Do you believe Brian was murdered?

A - I don't think he was murdered. I don't think he was worth being murdered at that time. He didn't have the power of a John Lennon when he died. He was out of The Stones. He was just starting something possibly new, maybe something powerful. I don't think he was worth murdering to anyone at that time. Now, I could be wrong. I wasn't there. I don't know those details. My gut feeling is that he was not murdered. I think possibly there was a good amount of negligence. I think Brian's physical death was the last act in a long line of self-destructive acts. He was not a very self-preserving person. He wasn't really concerned with tomorrow or keeping himself alive or trying to better himself, and I don't mean making more money, I mean getting his head together. He was not on a course towards growth and stability. I think he was somewhat intent on destroying himself after a certain point. I think he gave up a certain interest in his life, and living things. In some ways it was a good thing he left The Stones. That was a turning point for him. As I presented in my book, he was very miserable in The Stones for a long time and looking for other directions. But, he was too afraid to leave The Stones. He feared he would be a nobody and have nothing for himself if he were not a Rolling Stone. When he did leave the band, he was finally saying in some way, "Listen, I'd rather be Brian Jones than a Rolling Stone. I'll just take my chances with my own life." And who knows what he would have done?

© Gary James. All rights reserved.

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